[FC-discuss] FreeCulture.org is now Students for Free Culture
Christina Xu
kxu at fas.harvard.edu
Wed Oct 3 13:38:48 JST 2007
There is the matter, of course, of the fact that there aren't necessarily a
large number of students interested in the topics at all schools. I remember
there being a lot of discussion about how best to help small chapters, and
IMHO that is to reach out to other members of the community who are not
necessarily students.
And while we're at it, how are we describing student? Or university? Harvard
has an Extension school where people who aren't necessarily
college-student-age can attend without having to be full-time students. And
what about alumni? Alumni of those extension schools? People between college
and grad school (as you were yourself until very recently)? I'm not
pro-watering-down necessarily, but it seems to me that we're working with
very vague definitions already.
Christina
On 10/2/07, Nelson Pavlosky <nelson at freeculture.org> wrote:
>
> Why not start something called e.g. "the Boston Free Culture Coalition",
> and have the local Students for Free Culture chapters join that, along
> with every other interested person and group in Boston? That would be
> one way to get everyone involved and avoid artificially limiting
> activity to the campus and students, while maintaining e.g. the Harvard
> Free Culture chapter as a separate entity specifically focused on
> organizing at Harvard.
>
> It may be easier for you to organize people off-campus who are already
> interested in free culture than to educate and organize students on
> campus who are clueless. However, it is precisely when it is hard that
> it is the most valuable. Reaching out to the off-campus community is
> nice and is certainly worth doing, but the Harvard chapter of Students
> for Free Culture should focus on getting Harvard students involved and
> engaged with these issues, because nobody else is going to do that job
> for you. You are uniquely situated there to engage your peers, anyone
> could organize the people off campus.... work your comparative advantage!
>
> I'm not saying that you shouldn't work with non-students, or that you
> should only do on-campus events, but it seems to me like you should take
> care of your own campus/students and make sure you're doing a good job
> there before you worry about other people and places.
>
> Peace,
> ~Nelson~
>
> Elizabeth Stark wrote:
> > Again, to clarify, I'm not saying we should change our name yet again
> > (once is probably enough.) I'm just saying we shouldn't discourage
> > groups like ours, who have reached out to people in our surrounding
> > community successfully, not all of whom are students (but many of whom
> > are still young.)
> >
> > I'm not about to actively tell people they can't get involved and do
> > cool and interesting things with us merely because they're not
> > enrolled at a university. In a community like ours, academia often
> > mixes with many other fields, so it's also not always a bright line as
> > to what counts as a "campus" or "non-campus" action.
> >
> > If other chapters want to do things differently, that's fine with me.
> > We're not usually in the business of dictating what exactly each
> > chapter should do anyway. I just don't want to prohibit chapters from
> > reaching out to the broader community or enabling other people to get
> > involved, and it sounds like we're mostly in agreement here.
> >
> >
> > On 10/2/07, *Nelson Pavlosky* <nelson at freeculture.org
> > <mailto:nelson at freeculture.org>> wrote:
> >
> > I think that it makes sense to limit our focus to the schools of the
> > world rather than trying to be all things to all people... isn't
> > that a
> > big enough task? I think that organizing off-campus should not be
> > within our mission, and that we should avoid mission creep, e.g.
> > watering down the term "student" to mean "everyone in the
> > world". If we
> > find ourselves doing a lot of stuff that doesn't involve students
> and
> > youth, I think we should spin off a separate organization so that
> > we can
> > stay focused, and make sure that students remain in the driver's
> > seat of
> > this organization. Older people and people not involved with a
> > school/unversity in any way can certainly get involved and help
> > out, so
> > long as we maintain the clear mission of representing and organizing
> > *students* for free culture.
> >
> > Let's face it, most organizations with totally open membership
> > will end
> > up being run by older people with more experience and
> > connections... it
> > doesn't make sense to kick out old experienced leaders for new
> > greenhorn
> > students, *unless* you are trying to represent students and give
> > them a
> > voice. I think that it's important for us to give students a
> > voice, to
> > show that they genuinely care about free culture issues by
> organizing
> > them in a grassroots manner, by letting them speak for themselves,
> > and
> > no other organization in the field today offers that. If we water
> > ourselves down so that we just represent a vague group of people who
> > support free culture, I think that will make our organization less
> > valuable... what makes us different from e.g. iCommons at that
> > point? I
> > think Fred is right, serious off-campus organizing can probably be
> > done
> > through iCommons or an iCommons "node". Or the EFF, or PK, or
> > Copynight, or any of the numerous organizations in this field whom
> we
> > work with and support.
> >
> > However, if members of our chapters disagree on this point, guess
> > what?
> > We're holding elections soon for the Board of Directors. Members
> > of our
> > chapters can run for office, can make their position on whether we
> > should remain *students* for free culture part of their platforms,
> and
> > the chapters can vote them up or down on that issue, and the elected
> > Board can make motions in the desired direction. If the chapters
> want
> > to change our name yet again to reflect a different mission, or
> change
> > the purposes set forth in the bylaws, they can amend the bylaws
> > through
> > the official amendment process, and officially change our name for
> the
> > 3rd time. These issues will be decided through a democratic process
> > that represents what our student activists want to do with this
> > organization.
> >
> > And if that's not good enough, you always have the right to fork and
> > start your own org.
> >
> > Peace,
> > ~Nelson Pavlosky~
> > Co-founder, Students for Free Culture
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Elizabeth Stark wrote:
> > > We've actually worked quite successfully in Boston *with*
> > students and
> > > in universities as well as *beyond* academia. While it probably
> > makes
> > > sense at this point to be primarily university chapter-focused, I
> > > don't see why others can't get involved. I'd like to define
> > "student"
> > > as broadly as possible -- essentially, anyone with a willingness
> to
> > > learn.
> > >
> > > -E
> > >
> > > On 10/2/07, Fred Benenson <fred.benenson at gmail.com
> > <mailto:fred.benenson at gmail.com>> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Yes, it's a shame that some people can't find value in campus
> > organizing as
> > >> there's surely precedent.
> > >>
> > >> Crosbie: why not consider an organization such as iCommons
> > which has much
> > >> broader goals and membership?
> > >>
> > >> F
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On 10/2/07, Thomas (TJ) Olsen <tj at tjolsen.net
> > <mailto:tj at tjolsen.net>> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> absolutely disagree--students and academia in this country and
> > globally
> > >>> have a long history of great activism and creative output
> > >>>
> > >>> tj
> > >>> ----- Original Message -----
> > >>> From: "Crosbie Fitch" < crosbie at cyberspaceengineers.org
> > <mailto:crosbie at cyberspaceengineers.org>>
> > >>> To: "'Discussion of Free Culture in general and this
> organization
> > >>> inparticular'" <discuss at freeculture.org
> > <mailto:discuss at freeculture.org>>
> > >>> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 6:52 PM
> > >>> Subject: Re: [FC-discuss] FreeCulture.org is now Students for
> > Free Culture
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>> I would have thought "Artists for Free Culture" would have
> > been better.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Or even "Free Citizens for Free Culture"
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I would suspect that the popular conception of a student is a
> > passive
> > >>>> receptacles for knowledge, only expected to start doing
> anything
> > >>>> significantly productive/creative until after they've ceased
> > being a
> > >>>> student.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> The last thing a passive receptacle needs is the freedom to
> > publish
> > >>>>
> > >> copies
> > >>
> > >>>> or derivatives. People will assume students are just after
> > broader
> > >>>> educational exemptions for using the library photocopier.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> So 'Students for Free Culture' comes across as if it was
> > "Couch Potatoes
> > >>>> for
> > >>>> Free Culture".
> > >>>>
> > >>>> At worst "Students can't afford much, so we should get the
> > world's
> > >>>>
> > >> culture
> > >>
> > >>>> free of charge. Thanks."
> > >>>>
> > >>>> The best light it can be put in is "Typically militant
> > students having
> > >>>>
> > >> the
> > >>
> > >>>> luxury of being able to agitate against cultural oppression
> > of the
> > >>>>
> > >> masses"
> > >>
> > >>>> What's so special about a student?
> > >>>>
> > >>>> That's what I want to know.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> If you say 'many people showed up who were not aware that we
> > were a
> > >>>> student
> > >>>> organization', perhaps instead of concluding that you need to
> > strengthen
> > >>>> the
> > >>>> student angle, you could have concluded that you should ditch
> > the
> > >>>>
> > >> student
> > >>
> > >>>> angle (even if students do constitute the key demographic
> > most able to
> > >>>> perceive the corruption in copyright and patent).
> > >>>>
> > >>>> The last thing a body that champions cultural freedom should
> > be is
> > >>>> exclusive.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> If only FreeCulture.org was now 'Everyone for Free Culture'
> > >>>>
> > >>>> "We found people were confused when we said it was a student
> > >>>>
> > >> organisation,
> > >>
> > >>>> so we've stopped saying that. We now just say it's an open and
> > >>>>
> > >> egalitarian
> > >>
> > >>>> organisation that welcomes everyone interested in promoting
> > cultural
> > >>>> freedom"
> > >>>> _______________________________________________
> > >>>> Discuss mailing list
> > >>>> Discuss at freeculture.org <mailto:Discuss at freeculture.org>
> > >>>> http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> > <http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>> _______________________________________________
> > >>> Discuss mailing list
> > >>> Discuss at freeculture.org <mailto:Discuss at freeculture.org>
> > >>> http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Discuss mailing list
> > >> Discuss at freeculture.org <mailto:Discuss at freeculture.org>
> > >> http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> > <http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Discuss mailing list
> > > Discuss at freeculture.org <mailto:Discuss at freeculture.org>
> > > http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Discuss mailing list
> > Discuss at freeculture.org <mailto:Discuss at freeculture.org>
> > http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Discuss mailing list
> > Discuss at freeculture.org
> > http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Discuss mailing list
> Discuss at freeculture.org
> http://freeculture.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
>
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